Amateur TAB-Outlawed!

For discussion of all general music topics, Favored Nations artists, Vai-related musicians and all other artists and bands.
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Big Bad Bill
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"The music industry is to extend its copyright war by taking legal action against websites offering unlicensed song scores and lyrics. The Music Publishers' Association (MPA), which represents US sheet music companies, will launch its first campaign against such sites in 2006."

I feel very strongly about this. I use TAB obtained from PowerTAB Archive as a learning tool and a way of getting TAB for music that isn't made commercially available. And yet, I can't construct a good argument against banning such sites. Does anyone here have an opinon or good argument? It would be serious handicap to my playing should sites such as this become outlawed.
sonny sixshooter
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It's interesting how they keep harassing their own customers. Don't they realise that we pay their salaries? Don't bite the hand that feeds you...

I don't get it. They loose money because someone steals a cd in pre-production, therefore they attack those who actually buy the cds. now they want to attack those who want to play music!? Now we are not even allowed to play the songs on ur own instruments at home? Odd. They want to keep people from learning how to play, so that they can control the entire market.

Funny. 1984was about a communist state, and now it seems that it is happening within the world of music.
rikimaru
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Just got this from the BBC:

"Musical instrument shops must pay an annual royalty to cover shoppers who perform a recognisable riff before they buy, thereby making a "public performance".

My joke about this in a previous thread is coming true by degrees.
This is really gettig worrying.
Henrique Henriques
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These news are either a JOKE or very worrysome.

A perfect example of art becoming a product of the industrialized world.

I wonder what the artits themselves think about that?
cioran
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It is no joke, and it is very worrying indeed. On the PTA forum there is now a very lively debate going on, the nature of which pretty much sums up how ridiculous this state of affairs is. There are the pro-actives, who want to petition the MPA and state their grievances, and there are those, including the site manager, who hope that by keeping a very low profile PTA would somehow fly under the radar and evade discovery. I don't see that working for more than 0.002 seconds, but it's his (the site manager's)opinion, which I guess he's entitled to. In any event, he has shut down the site in order to stay out of legal trouble.
As for arguments; certainly a few tabbers are copying published tab books and not giving due credit, but I'd say 97% of the tabs out there are made by hard-working enthusists, who (importantly) have nothing to gain financially. Also, the MPA is saying musicians and professional tabbers are being cheated, and sharing tabs is no better than stealing music off the net. This is, of course, so deceptive it's frightening. Tabbers are providing learning tools for fellow musicians by posting, almost exclusively, tabs that have never been, and never will be, published commercially. Seen any tab books for Non Serviam or Dodheimsgard recently? Moreover, the tab sites I've visited make it clear that what you're getting is the individual tabber's interpretation of a particular song, no more or less. If you are concerned about cheating an artist, buy the book, if there is one - and if it's official, of course. Further, what about guitar tabs for classical pieces, like a Bach violin partita? Intellectual property rights should then belong to the tabber, as I understand the rules concerning works more than 50 years old.
Also, what about transcriptions and tabs I make for my students? Should I force them to scour the publishing houses' product lists and make them order something from halfway across the world at great expense so as not to step on any toes? This hasn't been adressed yet, but judging by copying rights for academic textbooks it may not be long.
Further, (this is getting tiring), PT and GP are someone's software, and making MIDI files for these should stand in a different legal domain in all events, especially since GP is fairly expensive, whether you use it to tab or just see and hear someone else's tabs.
All in all, a ludicrous state of affairs, typical of your bl***y country. The idea that musicians shouldn't be able to communicate and share their insights and ideas goes against everything music stands for. It is particularly saddening that most tabbers love the music in question, and want others to partake in the joy of playing it.
For this, the MPA literally want people not just fined, but preferably jailed, as well. (Check out BBC:s article, link at PTA. I hold no opinios on the lyrics issue). The MPA:s losses can only be marginal, but nevertheless, they go to war against the great community of musicians. Mammon is indeed powerful.
cioran
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What the heck, I'll make it easy for you to see what the MPA says:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/4508158.stm

I'm sort of hoping for a little critical reading between the lines here. I'd be interested in your opinions....
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Big Bad Bill
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Before I begin, I should say that I whole-heartedly concur with your sentiments, cioran. However, by having access to online TAB I do indeed avoid buying commerially available TAB and thus deprive the publishers of potential income! I may wish to learn one song by the Chill Peppers and to do so, I'd search for it online and definitley not buy the whole album from the publisher. I suppose what I would do is weigh up how badly I wished to learn the piece of music and decide if I were going to buy the whole book! What would actually happen to me is I'd never bother learning music unless I really wanted to. So the MPA are indirectly depriving me of a musical education. Perhaps the US has an amendment (or whatever they call them) to protect my rights (except I'm not American, of course!)

In a world of fair competition (which we all know doesn't exist), you'd think the publishers would fight back by offeing a better product- perhaps highly accurate TAB, inspected and passed as being 'good' by the composers themselves, playing tips from the composer etc etc.

Gazing into my crystal ball I think I can see what will happen. We're going to end up with an 'iTunes' for TAB where we pay £0.79 per sheet or something-where the money goes to the composer or whoever owns the rights to the music! It's not what I want, but it's better than nothing.

As for the playing riffs in shops and guitar tutors being prosecuted for writing out TAB-well that may become law, but it'll be impossible to enforce and these activities will continue with occasional prosecution of those who flagrently flaunt the rules.
cioran
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Yes, BBB, I do see your point about being reluctant to pay for a whole book if one song is all you are interested in. This , of course, is the only way the MPA comes even close to having a reasonable cause for what they intend to do - but it's a very slim argument indeed. As I said above, almost always you're getting someone's interpretation of how a piece of music should be played. Tabbers looking for recognition and just working for the joy of it are unlikely to simply plagiarize a commercially available book - it'd be spotted at once, and they would be shamed in the community of tabbers. To repeat; what we are being deprived of is the hard work people put into sharing such tabs as will never otherwise be published. The very vast majority of tabs I've seen fall into this category. It's sharing ideas about music and its performance - that this should be banned because of a few misdeeds is appaling.
As for "legitimate" tabs on the net - why not? Some bands publish them freely on their websites, probably because they are eager to be fully appreciated. And an "iTabs" service for those musicians who do publish books would probably be a great success - I would gladly pay for sheet music to individual songs if they are transcribed by the composer, who knows his own work best.
However, dammit, if I'm having trouble with something off Naglfar's Ex Inferis album, these sites are the only place where someone who shares my passion can post, to my benefit and noone's detriment. It keeps coming back to that, which is why I'm so steamed.
As for the American Constitution and its Amendments, they aren't faring so well right now...
Js1000
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MPA = MOST PUTRID A-HOLES!
axehappy
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I've been tabbing stuff online for about 5 years now.
I'm not gonna mention any site names, cos I don't want to bring any attention to those sites, but I've done it all for free.
Occassionally I receive donations from people who have found my tabs helpful, but I've always stressed that I don't want paying for them.. if they send me a donation for the time I spend doing that stuff, then that is fair enough.
So the financial gain is minimal... I couldn't make a living by writing tabs.
I can understand them going after the PTA site and MySongbook.com, as sites like those do have a lot of tabs that are taken straight from the book, and that must be illegal.

But me... even if they close all the sites down, I won't stop tabbing... I'll just do it all through email to some of the people I tab most regularly for.
I don't buy tab books anyway, because I don't need too, and the music I tab isn't commercially available in tab form, so who's getting hurt?

Only the music lovers.... same as always... :(
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al
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this is gettin outa hand check out no.4 on this list

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4520854.stm

its not on!!
cioran
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In this case, frankly, I think the Times (BBC:s source) and a certain music shop owner are going for a publicity stunt. If I understand the context correctly, store owners anually pay a sum for rights to play CD:s, DVD:s etc. as part of their marketing - but this guy says it's about customers playing what they choose whilst trying out instruments. I think it's a dud. There's a thread about it here: http://www.tes.co.uk/section/staffroom/ ... readPage=1 Some people in this thread seem to understand that this can't possibly have been correctly reported, and I'm inclined to agree. Check it out, though, and make of it what you will, although it gets a bit confused at times. Our main issue remains, though, but I've gone on a bit about that already...Take care.
Js1000
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4. Musical instrument shops must pay an annual royalty to cover shoppers who perform a recognisable riff before they buy, thereby making a "public performance".
that's just bs
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Big Bad Bill
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Will I have to pay to whistle in the street? This just shows the lengths that greedy people will go to.
ernzzz
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Js1000 wrote:
4. Musical instrument shops must pay an annual royalty to cover shoppers who perform a recognisable riff before they buy, thereby making a "public performance".
that's just bs
:lol: that gotta be a joke...
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