danielarlington wrote:Shawn Lane doesnt not PICK 19nps..
You are indeed correct. Great usage of double negative.
spanishphrygian wrote:Paco De Lucia plays 23 nps using his fingers; which, is very much harder then using a simple pick. On top of that, he plays it on a Flamenco Style Guitar that is a lot harder to play then an Electric, and the strings are farther apart as well!
I have to say that Paco is the fastest.
I don't think any of us could even come close to what Paco does with his shredding. Sorry but the facts are hard and cold.
Ricardo wrote:Hi willjay. Of course you are right about Paco. Strange how fast and sharp and clear Paco can articulate each note at those speeds. His nephew is a notch faster than him, as can be seen on the DVD "FRANCISCO SANCHEZ". The tune Caña de Azucar, it is around 117bpm, Paco sticks to 6's (sextuplet 24th notes, 11.7 nps), but his nephew banderas launches into a decending run of 8's (32 notes). It is all about rhythmic control with those guys, not cramming notes into a beat persay.
But the fastest I have heard Paco litterally doing a long alternate finger picked run on record, is a tune called "Chanela". Which is about that same speed, 8's at 116 or so. Under 16nps obviously, but so controlled and sweet and clear. It is a problem because just because you don't hear them do it in song doesn't not mean they can't. They are controlling the rhythm, so to push faster is "wrong". They keep in the limits that the song allows for. Little speed bursts here and there should not count.
I guess McLaughlin and others can go faster with alternate picking. But there are other techniques in flamenco, which might have given that idea of 23 nps. For example, there are rasgueados that may use 3 fingers to attack, flicking the wrist. Those can produce speeds close to 20 nps, yet those rhythms must again come out clear and clean. Of course that is not the point of the speed picking contest going on here, but that is real control.
Check it out between 4:25-4:27. I think it is around 180-190 bpm, 6's.
Anyway, I check out your vids of Shawn Lane on youtube. Never heard him much before. Very melodic and sensitive player. I love it. But the super speed in spots is really out of left field for me, doesn't fit the tune. but his normal soloing is so nice. I missed the speed you clocked for him alternate picking at 18 nps. could you post again please? Looks like the super speed stuff is economy picking but man it sounds weird it is so fast.
PS, I think that Paco is not under rated. He gets the highest accolades in the flamenco world. And yeah, perhaps the overall best guitarist of all time. But not necessarily the "fastest".
Ricardo wrote:Thanks willy! But you know your counting is off. In the slow clip, version 1, if that is the true full "second", you hear the claps marking beats. The strumming is clearly 3 hits per clap (well to me since I know the technique his doing there, I guess it is noisy), and there are 6 claps in your clip. That is 18 notes. And there is a lead in which is fuzzy but sounds like 1 or 2 notes. Since there is time for a pick-up clap, I feel that it is two sounds there, could be if we had another beat to go on, so literally the speed of the strumming is 20 nps. The really amazing thing is the off beat clapper is swinging hard right with the triplets!
Can you do a slow version of the Lane picking? It is really insane! Tempo is around 130 I guess and he is playing 32nd notes? Is that close?
actually seperate the sounds i hear, and only count the type of sound i want to count.