Vai has no feel

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Mikey
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#286 Post by Mikey » Mon Jan 08, 2007 8:14 pm

I have never heard Steve say "There's a Fire In The House" is his favorite song. I'm not speaking for Steve here, but I can tell you that if you asked him what some of the favorite pieces he has written are, you'd be more likely to hear him mention songs like "I'm Your Secrets", "Under It All", "Dying For your Love", "Love Secrets", "Essence", "Frangelica" etc.

The real rub is: how do you define soul? How do you quantify it? Are you just saying that Hendrix or Claption's music has soul because someone told you it does? Or because the notes mean something to you?

Soul is really how a song makes you feel, and you interpret that as being how the artists feels. It's both a cliche and a misconception that players who can play fast, or have excellent technical ability lack soul in their playing. Their expression comes from a deep place, and no matter what genre, or how they express themselves, what they make and put out into the world is their art and its deeply personal.

Take Yngwie for example - he's somewhat of an easy target for people who like bashing fast players. But Yngwie puts his heart and his soul into his playing. He's passionate and fiercely proud of what he does and how he does it. You might listen to it and think it sounds like a swarm of angry bees in a jar - but that doesn't mean that the music isn't great, or has no soul. It just lacks the unquantifyable qualities that speak to YOU.

I love bands like Meshuggah, Strapping Young Lad and Devin Townsend. This is music that many people find barely listenable, or just too intense. But to me, there is incredible soul and passion in that music and it touches me and affects me deeply. To me, it has soul. To my grandmother, it sounds like a migraine in the making.

I love Tool, but Dream Theater doesn't appeal to me. Is one better or more valid than the other? No. I know people for whom a Dream Theater concert is like a religious experience - and good for them. But what I can't bring into question is the heart and soul both bands put into their ART.

To start being a music snob can be dangerous. It can close your mind, and that might mean you miss out on music that may have really been lifechanging had you just given it a chance. Listen to what appeals to you, and don't listen to what you don't like. If you start comparing artists, then you bring competition into the mix, and that's not what art is about.

Bringing it back to Steve: Steve isn't Hendrix or Clapton or Page. But by the same token, nnone of them are Steve Vai either. Each has contributed greatly to the music world, and in a slightly smaller sphere, the world of guitar. What is the point in comparing any of them when they all have a different message and voice?

Well that's enough wasted time for one evening.

Mikey
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#287 Post by cnc74 » Mon Jan 08, 2007 8:53 pm

Not wasted time at all. I totally agree. There are so many genres of music that touch me for different reasons. Every artist puts his/her heart and soul into their music. There are some I can take or leave, and there are some I need to take with a grain of salt. But, it is their form of expressing themselves. And for that, I totally respect them.
It's so true about the whole competition issue. I remember Steve once saying, "Music shouldn't be about competition. That's why we have sports."
Mikey hit the nail on the head when he says not to become a music snob. I had taken a friend with me to see Steve on the RI tour. She had never heard one thing by Steve, but figured she would hate it because there was no singing. Through the whole show her jaw was on the floor. Once the show was over she looked at me and said, " I think I just had a life changing experience." She also told me that she would never be close minded ever again. She now owns all of Steve's CD's and can't wait for his next tour.
I guess you just know when someone touches your soul. I was ten years old, and from the minute I heard Steve play, I knew there was something there..I needed to have his cd's and learn everything I possibly could about him. You just know when someone has found that place in your heart.
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#288 Post by *theanimal*05 » Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:16 am

i started this topic sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long ago and its still going strong.
must be a hot topic rofl

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#289 Post by ebrown » Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:43 am

Although I agree with the animal, I'm kinda glad this thread is still alive now just because Mikey posted a very excellent post.

"What is the point in comparing any of them when they all have a different message and voice?"

This is the crucial point.

I am primarily a classical guitarist, however a few years ago I picked up electric guitar and soon discovered Steve. Since I picked up electric guitar, people like to ask me, "What do you like more? Classical or electric?" Usually I avoid the question because love them both, each for different reasons though and mostly because they each have a different message and a voice. This is the same reason why I can't make a top ten favourite songs of all time list or a top ten favourite bands/artist, because each song/band/artist has something different to say and appeals to different parts of me. When I listen to Bach his genius song writing shines through, when I listen to Pat Metheny his melodies and relaxed tone appeal to me and when I listen to Dream Theater their complex rhythms, powerful riffs and exquisite solos astound me. But if you asked me to pick which one I like the most I can't do it, because they all have a different message and a voice.

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#290 Post by EyE » Tue Jan 09, 2007 4:19 am

I hate topics like these. But all I have to say is.......it's all a matter of taste. One likes Clapton, Van Halen, Hendrix or Vai! It really is a matter of your personal music taste. So ones favorite is Clapton, also fine. I like Clapton, Van Halen, Hendrix, Beck and a whole bunch of other players. But "my" favorite is Vai!! When I first heard Vai I was 14. I knew Hendrix, Van Halen, Clapton, Gary Moore etc. but Vai blew me away. Now 21 years later Vai still moves me. By fare!!
And "soul"? Everyone of these artist above have soul. Doesn't matter how fast you play or how long you can hold a note. They still need soul to deliver.
Last edited by EyE on Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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#291 Post by slash89 » Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:33 am

*theanimal*05 wrote:i started this topic sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long ago and its still going strong.
must be a hot topic rofl
It is (inho) a crying shame that even some of our members agree with that guitar "teacher" :roll:

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#292 Post by Splish » Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:04 pm

slash89 wrote:
*theanimal*05 wrote:i started this topic sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long ago and its still going strong.
must be a hot topic rofl
It is (inho) a crying shame that even some of our members agree with that guitar "teacher" :roll:
Seconded... :roll:

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#293 Post by Mr. Bluesman » Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:18 pm

Point is - someone who says something like that doesn't deserve and obviously isn't capable of being a teacher, let alone forward his 'knowledge' to younger players.

There is this constant fight... Blues-emotion-soul-feeling VS Shred-technique-speed-boring.

OK, some of the people are right, pointless shredding without musicality IS stupid, and emotion-less, but Steve Vai does not belong to that group.

Your guitar teacher should quit his job, or do some re-thinking.

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#294 Post by slash89 » Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:21 pm

Mr. Bluesman wrote:Point is - someone who says something like that doesn't deserve and obviously isn't capable of being a teacher, let alone forward his 'knowledge' to younger players.

There is this constant fight... Blues-emotion-soul-feeling VS Shred-technique-speed-boring.

OK, some of the people are right, pointless shredding without musicality IS stupid, and emotion-less, but Steve Vai does not belong to that group.

Your guitar teacher should quit his job, or do some re-thinking.
I think quitting the job would do the trick :lol:

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#295 Post by lydian2000 » Tue Jan 09, 2007 5:13 pm

Splish wrote:
slash89 wrote:
*theanimal*05 wrote:i started this topic sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo long ago and its still going strong.
must be a hot topic rofl
It is (inho) a crying shame that even some of our members agree with that guitar "teacher" :roll:
Seconded... :roll:

Splish
Thirded....

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#296 Post by spanishphrygian » Tue Jan 09, 2007 7:58 pm

I disagree with all of you. Steve Vai is the best, and nobody else has as much soul.


Except for maybe me. :lol:

I listen to the best music there is.

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#297 Post by another virtuoso » Tue Jan 09, 2007 8:14 pm

lydian2000 wrote:
Splish wrote:
slash89 wrote:It is (inho) a crying shame that even some of our members agree with that guitar "teacher" :roll:
Seconded... :roll:

Splish
Thirded....
fourth...ded?

i think i posted a comment laughing at how one of the most popular threads in this forum is one slamming our mr Vai a long time ago back on like page 13 or so.
i dont guess it will ever go away :roll:

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#298 Post by kettil » Sat Jan 13, 2007 9:04 pm

Just wanted to say that to me, feeling is a communication between the performer and the audience. Since someone has active listeners, he also has "feeling" :P

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#299 Post by Lotus Eater » Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:44 pm

Most of the time people are just bashing an artist for not creating music in a scope that they can fully comprehend. There is always some other level of expression that is either more or less informative than whatever example you start with. The level of conciousness exuded by some is dwarfed by the deluge of others. Perhaps you should ask yourself why you don't understand the complexities or simplicities of certain artists' projects. Stop blaming them for your lack of amusement. If you want a continued debate about Clapton and Beck VS Vai or Yngwie, I know a 9 year old girl that will argue "Jewel" can rally them all. It's all relative. Let our taste govern what we enjoy to listen to, not our ignorance.

The lack of tolerance around us is utterly astounding.

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#300 Post by Christophar » Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:33 pm

Good job mikey.

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