Musician's Friend and Guitar Center vs. the #1 350dxguy

For discussion of Ibanez, other guitars, and general guitar topics.
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Mr Clark
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uhm, the situation is self correcting in this case, because of high level of competition and the ease of gathering information, but the neoclassical theory and adam smith's invisible hand function only in rare cases :wink:
Ultraviolet
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(Nice Guitar Mr. Clark! ;), and, may I ask you,... would you buy the Jem if you had the bucks to spare? or did you get that one because it suits your style more than the Jem?)
Last edited by Ultraviolet on Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Mr Clark
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i got the rg350dx because i was a beginner, i might be in the market for a jem in a year or two, but i don't know, i need to try a few guitars first 8)
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notavirtuoso
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In your example I would recommend one the following options:

A. The "musician" needs to save his money for overpriced eggs and water and at least consider working up to getting a phone.
B. They need to save their money to escape from the imaginary town where the only connection to the outside world is a Musician's Friend catalog and one guy with a phone. Perhaps they could move somewhere that Sam Ash delivers catalogs to.
C. Being in an economically challenged community they should take up a cheaper hobby, or at least cheaper instrument such as a harmonica and start playing the blues.
D. For $399, he could buy a few chickens and undercut the grocery store on egg prices. With his profits he could build slowly build an Egg Empire with a price match guarantee.
Ultraviolet
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ha ha ha :lol: :lol: :lol:
Last edited by Ultraviolet on Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:46 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Jeroen
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Somebody please pass the popcorn

J
TheOtnip
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Jeroen wrote:Somebody please pass the popcorn

J
I agree, entertaining, but a little sad...
Ultraviolet
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what is sad, is that if you had the ability to se your own unique spiritual energy you would see that,...in this dimension,...and in this space time,.....you are a hollow colorless blob of anomalous molecules with no shape or color or purpose. you merely occupy space
Last edited by Ultraviolet on Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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notavirtuoso
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My ego is just fine, hence the name notavirtuoso. That name kind of exhibits a level of self awareness, don't you think? To be a virtuoso has nothing to do with ego, and everything to do with talent. I don't have the talent to be a virtuoso. I play for fun and I'm fine with that. My ego does not require me to boast of my accomplishments or how many tough times I've persevered through.

As far a Haiti, Musician's Friend is not authorized to sell Ibanez products to be shipped outside the United States. Ibanez does not have a distributor listed that services Haiti. I'm afraid I don't have a suggestion to help our imaginary Haitian friend get his Ibanez guitar.

If you'll read my post again, I didn't say what anyone has to do. I believe you'll find I used the word recommend. This does not constitute me telling anyone where they should or shouldn't live or what they should or shouldn't save for. It's a suggestion.

Also, I haven't steered clear of your point at all. I did in that last post because I have made my point in previous posts that you've decided to not respond to. I'll spell it out for you one more time: It is solely the responsibility of the consumer to shop around for the best deal. As I've written previously, Musician's Friend has not made any claims of any kind that would indicate they have the cheapest advertised price on anything. The prices I see on most things are right in line with everyone else. Like I said, some things will be higher and some lower. I don't think I can make it any more clear than that.

The thing most obvious to me about you is that you ignore valid arguments against your point of view. I would guess that's the reason you weren't captain of the debate team. Or, if you were, I'm guessing you lost. A lot.
Ultraviolet
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:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
balrogs are nice fluffy comforting escorts to different plains of existence. They like to give you ice cream and money and power and let you know that they wouldn't do a thing to make your unique soul energy at all uncomfortable while it re-arranges the universe

sure they are
especially when it is in an uncontrollable rage that only Madonna's energy can soothe, or Steves energy can guide........
ever had confidence against a fear you never imagined yet?
Last edited by Ultraviolet on Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:57 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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notavirtuoso
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I assure you, I don't work for them. If I did I would have a lot more gear than I have now. The only reason I defend them is that they haven't done anything that any other business hasn't. Personally, I don't buy from them a lot, although I have made some purchases there. I try to support my local shops. On big items they'll price match with no problems. On little items I don't mind paying a little extra because I get more than that in service, advice and expertise. You just can't get that on the internet no matter how good your customer service is. I can't take my guitar to Musician's Friend for them to work on and that's important to me. I don't do anything other than minor maintenance to my guitars mainly because I don't trust myself to do it without messing it up. I can't afford to tweak my neck from a truss rod adjustment gone wrong. Also, If I have a problem with something I bought I don't have to ship it across the country for someone I've never met to say, "the problem can't be duplicated" and ship it back with no repairs. That being said, I can't fault Musician's Friend at all. They have a great website that I use a lot for researching purchases. They sell a lot more products than the local shops in my area have access to. When I do order something from them I haven't encountered any problems or had any complaints. If I didn't live near a decent shop I'm sure I would utilize them more.
Jeries
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Off the top of my head exact cost on that guitar which is what mf/guitar center pays for that guitar from ibanez Is $261.

Whoever is calling gc/mf crooks...or this or that and they're ripping off people...

What do you do for a living? Whatever it is you don't do it for free, you'd say it would be unfair to be paid nothing and not right... So what is wrong with a musicians friend MAKING MONEY.
They didn't go into business to help out musicians or bullshit like that. They go in to biz to maximize profits.

For those in the USA... Go into a biz and if u see an american flag in the window or on a sticker at the register...
Is that there because they give a shit about america? Or so they look better and more holsom as a company so you shop there more than the other store next door without the flag on the door
What's wrong with a company making money... There are plenty of stuff daily musiciansfriend sells that clearly loose money-they don't complain, its just a part of business;but profit is the goal of anyone in biz
Ultraviolet
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Rock on Modest almost a virtuoso,..
you may be one someday if you put ALL of your heart into it.
good conversation in regards to my favorite guitar for the money, besides my secret Rhoads platform in the works from the man himself. came to me in a dream,..where I designed it,..and payed for it,.and had it delivered,...it is priceless.

Peace and Love to you,
from the temple of Ultraviolet :)
Last edited by Ultraviolet on Mon Jun 16, 2008 12:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
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notavirtuoso
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Somehow I missed this whole paragraph when I responded earlier.
Ultraviolet wrote:yes apparently it IS up to the consumer to shop around......who in their right mind is gonna have the preface to shop around, when they can just put it on a credit card and make 15 dol a mo payments......it's not like the thing cost 20 grand.
This is the logic that has put so many people in impossible situations with credit card debt. I say who in their right mind wouldn't shop around for something they're going to go into debt for. Here's a tip for anyone: Do not ever buy a toy on credit. No guitars. No amps or effects. Nothing. This is very difficult to accomplish but believe me if it's worth going into debt for, it's worth saving up for instead.

Ultraviolet wrote:they are RELYING on people to SLIP through the cracks,...and NOT NOTICE the OVERAGE,....and it's not like THEY DECLARE TO EACH PERSON ON THE PHONE TO SHOP AROUND. WHICH in theory they should,....
This statement is beyond the realm of naive.

Ultraviolet wrote: because even at the 399 they are still making profit,. the thing cost like 120 bucks from Hoshino.
they are too greedy man.
Contrary to popular belief, the cost of goods generally has no bearing on the market price of a lot of items. The price is what people are willing to pay. The $399 amount is the minimum advertised price that Ibanez will allow. Ibanez does this so that no dealers can cut throat other dealers making it impossible to compete. It's very common practice in numerous fields.
Ultraviolet wrote: which is why i say THEY SUCK TERD FARTS and I would gladly PISS ON RICHARD EASTMAN if i had the oppertunity to make him MORE holy than he is by adding the PISS from a REAL DECENT HUMAN upon the temple of that human FLYVOMMIT.
This is an example of why you haven't garnered any support here for your point of view. It's a childish display of ignorance and stupidity.
Ultraviolet wrote: and for the most part I totally agree with you,..
which is why them overcharging on that model,...
now that they are freshly carrying ibanez with in the last few mos,....at least that's what i've noticed,...
makes no sense.....because up till now,...I have always liked them....and mostly their VAST SELECTION ....can't say there is any other real unique quality they posess other than sheer quantity of selection.
Musician's Friend has been selling Ibanez products for years. And yes, their selection is easily their biggest asset.
Ultraviolet wrote: I am all for buisnesses making proffit,....and so are you aparently, but wouldn't you be a bit concerned personally if you saw ernie ball selling the strings you payed 8 bucks for for 30 dollars a pack,...too much proffit is greed.
This is where basic economics principles come in. The established market will not support a price increase like that. They will simply move on to a different brand or alternative methods.

Ultraviolet wrote:CAR AUDIO ELECTRONICS has the highest markup value of ANY product in the world,...just so you know,....and i am at the TOP of th epyramid as far as that goes so i am WELL AWARE of "
buisnesses should make proffit" wanna buy a deck? go to any store I get it for 50 bucks new, YOU PEOPLE CAN'T but I'm not gonna sell it for more than like 200. I could get 300 but IM NOT GREEDY
wanna buy a subwoofer from any store? 10 12, 15 inch infinity, jbl, pioneer, fosgate, eclipse, focal, us amps, cerwin vega, mmats, kenwood, pyle, selenium, autotek, lanzar, xtant, or even mtx?(who offered me a FREE jackhammer by the way,...told them to keep it,..my 15 eats it for breakfast)
any of those subs will run you like 100-1000 dollars
the 1000 dollar ones I PAY 300 for NEW the 100 dollar ones I get by one get 2 free.
With your two man team you have a limited amount of overhead to cover. You don't have to come up with the capital to stock the 36,000 items Musician's Friend does. You don't have to pay for a 700,000 square foot warehouse, maintain it, pay property tax on it, heat and cool it, provide electricity and water for it or furnish it with equipment. I don't know how many employees they have but each one of them gets a paycheck. Just so you know, the cost of an employee is generally twice what their gross pay is when you factor in the cost of Worker's Compensation insurance, health care and other benefits, training and employee morale boosters (company picnics and the like). You don't have a huge, elaborate website to maintain or a software system to pay for that helps you manage everything. I doubt you have to pay a number of accountants and lawyers on a regular basis, or a marketing team. You also don't have investors to please. Not only must you make enough to cover all the above and a lot more that I didn't mention, you have to make sure your investors are getting a fair return on their money. Everyone always says they can make it up on volume. Well, if you aren't making any profit, the increased volume just means you lose more.

Ultraviolet wrote:Don't know why this particular event hasn't sat well with me,..it's not like I'm conciously trying to screw the companyu out of profit and stuff,...I just am someone who has bought 2 recently for 399. and am able to see the full picture behind the sneakiness of the price matching nonsense. like I said
why not just sell them for 399,..they would sell MORE of them,..they would make more proffit out of the sales number increases,....instead of them collecting dust which is what they have been doing. and people wouldn't be getting ripped off either.
The price matching nonsense is the standard of the industry and many others. I'd be willing to bet that every distributor out there has something that they don't have priced as low as others. As I said previously, they make a little more on one thing to make up for not making much on something else.

Ultraviolet wrote: Honesty, fairness, and propper buisness goes farther and does better for everyone concerned. now that they have gotten greedy. it has and will come back to bite them. even if I do nothing personally,.....but it's alittle late for that,..now,..the snowball's-a-rollin too late. the magnifying glass will reach them soon enough. Wink
I don't believe this is a new practice for Musician's Friend or any other online distributor out there. They've all been doing it for years. Like I said it is a standard practice in this and many other industries.
Ultraviolet wrote: Rock on Modest almost a virtuoso,..
you may be one someday if you put ALL of your heart into it.
good conversation in regards to my favorite guitar for the money, besides my secret Rhoads platform in the works from the man himself. came to me in a dream,..where I designed it,..and payed for it,.and had it delivered,...it is priceless.
I've enjoyed the conversation as well, it's been entertaining. I must confess I have no aspirations to be anywhere close to a virtuoso but I appreciate the sentiment. Good luck with your dream guitar. Dreams matter.
Ultraviolet
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Rock on!
Love to you
Ultraviolet
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